Lost in all the developments surrounding the X Prize Cup was a report that Lockheed Martin would invest $45 million towards the development of a spaceport in Nova Scotia for PlanetSpace. Well, so much for that. The Globe and Mail reported a day later that Canadian officials had quashed any such investment plans, which were tied to the Canadian government’s purchase of Lockheed-built C-130 cargo planes. “There have been no discussions between Industry Minister Prentice or any member of his staff regarding Lockheed Martin investing $45-million of its own money in the so-called PlanetSpace space-tourism project in Cape Breton. Nor will there be any such discussions,” a spokesman for Canada’s industry minister told the paper. Apparently government officials flinched at investing anything linked to space tourism: “Space tourism will be left to tourists.”
I thought RiPK was done for…
Oh my bad!
not RiPK…just other inept management.
Yah for government lacking vision…
Eh…
No Lockheed money for PlanetSpace…
Contrary to prior reports, Lockheed Martin is apparently not investing $45 million in a spaceport for PlanetSpace in Nova Scotia….
Number 2,
I believe it was a Freudian slip, what you meant to say was RiPlanetSpace, didn’t you?
My $ 0.02 worth.
I dont think this will keep those guys at Planet Space down for long..my 2 cents…Dr Keith
No offense Dr. Keith,
But “Those guys atPlanetSpace” have shown anything that could remotely be considered up.
Making press releases and telling everyone about grand plans and doing nothing is all these guys have ever done. At their initial press release they stated they would fly sub-orbitally within 2 years. Since the press conference was in the spring of 2005, that means they flew 6 months ago. If you have pictures or video, I hould love to see it.
Down appears to be the only direction they have.
My $ 0.02 worth.
But that is the nature of this industry look at Virgin and all the other companies that have made similar claims.Timelines will always shift in this industry.But only time will tell for Planet Space but I think they are by no means dead…far from it!! Dr Keith
Besides they also managed to get an unfunded COTS so there must be some significant value in what they have done so far for NASA to acknowledge their work as worthy.Just because deadlines are not met doesnt mean a team isnt moving forward!
dr Keith
Look also at the history of the announcements…Announcing running for the X-prize captured the team credibility and even though they lost the prize it allowed them to capture some serious sponsosrship and yes while they did announce…intent…to launch in 2yrs…this did not happen but COTS did.Changing plans and forfeiting an announced deadline will happen dependign on circumstances, but they have mangaged despite to keep upgrading with involved sponsorship now as unfunded COTS and other aerospace companies.People give up on dreams too easily and we may think of this team as dreamers..but its that dreaming that got them to where they are and they get my vote for “classmate most likely to succeed” in the emerging Space industry! Dr Keith
Keith…I would agree somewhat about the missing dates here and there. but for these guys this has become habitual. The organization is not what it used to be. Planetspace is a very different company than Canadian Arrow of years ago. Since Planetspace dissolved Canadian Arrow they have lost all of their talent. And the word is since a major rift inside the organization most of the brains and strength are no longer there.
What has planetspace done ever????
And as for the unfunded COTS deal, well NASA was passing those out like candy. anybody who wants one can get one. again what has Planetspace ever done????? Kathuria and Snake Oil Sheerin have rode Arrow into the ground.
Sad!
Ed:
I disagree…dont know anything about a major riff.And I doubt seriously NASA hands out COTS like candy…that statement belittles the credibility of a major govt organization so with all respect I hardly think COTS is given out as a “gift”. In terms of the brains in the company again with due respect you are just wrong.Planet Space has continued to earn the recognition of major aerospace companies and thus “increased” its talent and expertise by expanding its consortium partnerships! I see this situation as an analogy to a player moving from the OHL to the NHL.Planet Space did not win the first round draft choice from NASA but second round draft is non too shabby coming from the prestigious NASA!Mr Sheerin and Mr Chirinjeev have my vote and NASA’s obviously as well as other aerospace companies.You are right Canadian Arrow is not what it used to be…its moved beyond “loaded soda logos” and “Western Fairs and airshows” to the BIG league of major aerospace contender within the emerging industry> But my personal opinions wont matter..what will matter is how they perform in the coming years and they still get my vote for probable success.
Dr Keith you seem like a pretty sharp guy and you obviously hold a very positive view of Planetspace.
I think most people used to as well. but I think you will find that most people who have followed this company and it track record have moved
from excitement to indifferent to just plane sceptical. What I find puzzling though is how you have missed several key points that fly in the face of your argument.
First…you stated that.. “Planet Space did not win the first round draft choice from NASA but second round draft is non too shabby coming from the prestigious NASA!”
Planetspace has never been awarded COTS phase 1 or phase 2 they were not even on the short list. What they did receive was an unfunded COTS SAA
http://www.nasa.gov/centers/johnson/pdf/173096main_Planetspace_SAA.pdf (here is a pdf that out line their agreement and the required milestones.). They and several other companies received this SAA. No big achievement here. basically it is a piece of paper to show off to investors to prove that NASA knows you exist. As for the milestones on it , well they are to be completed by specific deadlines to show NASA that you are capable of doing what you say you can do, something that it seems they are not able to do. Remember all milestones must be achieved and by their specific dates. Hence why RiPK was terminated from COTS ( and they had received money)
So this leads me to my next point. They have not done anything since Planetspace dissolved Canadian arrow.
Nothing! There is no proof that Planetspace has achieved anything. Their only claim to fame is the remote connection to the now dead Canadian arrow
and an unfunded COTS agreement that everybody else got as well. Big deal!
Rather disappointing considering it was SOS (sheerin) that stated in the press that ‘we have found our Paul Allen’ back in spring of 2005.
Keith you should read some of the various internet discussion about these guys. You will find that they have been hoisted by there own petard on multiple occasions. “I disagree…dont know anything about a major riff”. Well I and others have heard about this “major rift” from several sources but the most recent was from an “insider” to the company that stated several key players and most of the original Canadian arrow crew are no longer there.
This is a good explanation as to why they can’t seem to get their act together and actually do something other than vaporware. They have lost their backbone and brains. The proof is in the track record.
Like RPK and other shady companies now they only seem to develop talk rather than technology.
And as for continuing to earn “recognition of major aerospace companies and thus increased its talent and expertise” I am going to make an assumption you are referring to their “done deal” with Lockheed for Athena and Nova scotia. Yes that really materialized well for them. And even if it had it would still be expertise by association…not really within the company as they would actually have to hire some personal from these aerospace organizations.
Keith I am not trying to come down on your perspective personally, rather try to present the facts so that you can see the big picture here. I would love for these guys to be able to do what they say they can do….but they have moved from doing just that to just ridiculous.
I would still contest that an unfunded COTS IS significant!And who said anything about dissolving Canadian Arrow? Bottom line I dont think Planet Space/Canadian Arrow has EVER claimed anything false…they have claimed intent to and maybe not met that goal but saying you intend to do something is different than claiming you have done and not actually done it!We are not going to change eachothers opinions here and all I have to say is “Wait and see…they are by no means done yet!”The only thing that will prove my opinion right is time but dont worry….it will happen!
Dr.Keith in light of the various facts and points I have presented to you, I am surprised that this would not raise questions for you. Do you know these guys or something? family member?
maybe if you do you could shed some more light as to what their deal is.
My final comment would be that calling people names “snake oil” certainly wins no credibility in my books.Name calling to prove a point only seems bitter or desparate and serves no purpose.
As far as Insider INfo…..save it for the tabloids because the blogs are thriving on supposed expert or insider opinions but in the BIG picture those dont matter.I have no doubt in the end “Those Guys at Planet Space” will be redeemed in the end by the results they achieve!
“I have no doubt in the end “Those Guys at Planet Space†will be redeemed in the end by the results they achieve!”
right! so when do determine the end. 5 years 10 20…You have to look at where you have been to know where you are going. It is all in their track record.
I hope you are not an investor in denial or something. Keith you have to look at this stuff objectively.
And you never answered my last question or addressed any of the points I made.
I know of a Dr.Keith H that used to post on the spacefellowship forum. Is that you. with regards to your comment about “snake oil sheerin” there is one other purpose you forgot and that is it is just funny. I wish I could take credit for this humours handle but that is a title that has been floating around on other forums. Maybe Chariton Sheerin makes more sense.
The industry is full of these types and it would be nice for the altspace industry to maintain some credibility.
I hope they prove me and others wrong. but Sheern
and company are rapidly moving into the realm of Not-so-flyin Brian status.
I am going to post back on RLV news and see if I can coax this “company insider” to provide some more info. There is even another poster who has a connection in Cape Breton Nova Scotia who has indicated that nothing has happened there yet. Would be nice if there was also some info regarding Ohio as they had plans for that too.
If they are posting on a blog without admitting who they really are and claiming “insider info” then they are just wanting to feel important and in my books are just “”Posers”!The only ones who REALLY know are not on a blog or forum group.So if that is what you are basing your opinions on there is no credibility in that!
I disagree I am not going to fault the individual for wanting to keep his or her anonymity, especial if they might be active in the company. As an example a lot of scams have been blown wide open with anonyms information from the inside.
Again Keith since we are debating this…you still have not addressed my questions and comments???
“If they are posting on a blog without admitting who they really are and claiming “insider info†then they are just wanting to feel important and in my books are just “â€Posersâ€!The only ones who REALLY know are not on a blog or forum group.So if that is what you are basing your opinions on there is no credibility in that!”
There are alot of people from the inside who post on blogs and forums…John Carmack, George French(not so much credibility there)guys from Maston, XCOR ….
Again Keith since we are debating this…you still have not addressed my questions and comments???
Keith can you offer anything to support your arguments other than blind faith in Planetspace, regardless of their history broken promises and current status?
Its not about “blind Faith”
I just object to your spin on it that is based on “hearsay”.You are portraying the company as having been untruthful and misleading and those are NOT FACTS…just opinion!
Why bother with this attack on the companies credibility….perhaps you are a competitor?If not then your opinions are just that…just opinions and rate only as far as the relevance of this blog…which isnt much considering we are the only posters on it
In terms of addressing your points:
1. COTS IS a big deal! Even unfunded and to say that “anyone could get one” Dont think so!Unfunded COTS is not a gift or some badge given out to anyone willing to apply…that is just wrong and you know it!So for Planet Space to get that IS having done something
2. The idea of some major rift or the Company falling apart is based on your hearsay from supposed “insiders”. If they were true “insiders” why would they delibarately sabatoge the reputation of their own company…that makes no sense!They are not insiders at all…likely some nonsense by a competitor.Persoanlly I think this is some sort of conspiracy to try to sabatoge the Companies credibility.Problem is there arent any facts to back it up….just opinions on a blog
Dr.Keith,
I agree with your comments about Canadian Arrow. That company did really significant stuff during X-Prize 1.0. My observations and comments are about PlanetSpace, the company that bought them back in 2005.
In the spring of 2005 they made a statement that they would fly in 24 months. I was a target they could “easily” attain, according to Geoff Sheerin in their History channel documentary.
They signed their unfunded COTS SAA until January 29th 2007.
http://www.nasa.gov/centers/johnson/pdf/173096main_Planetspace_SAA.pdf
21 or 22 months after their declaration of 24 months till flight.
You’re suggesting that they have an Arrow that’s virtually done and now mothballed because COTS is so important and the extra month or two to complete Arrow isn’t WORTH it?
I don’t buy it.
I don’t think their Arrow is close to completion. They haven’t shown any pictures or video of any further engine tests of drop tests or flight tests. Come to think of it, They haven’t shown any tests of any kind for either Arrow or their Golden Dart.
Canadian Arrow was fairly secretive about development, but always showed pictures and/or video.
My belief is that Canadian Arrow did that because they had something to show. PlanetSpace does not, therefore no pictures and/or video.
I stand by my observations, it’s a pitty, Canadian Arrow looked promising, PlanetSpace looks like Snake-Oil.
As for their meeting COTS milestones, see my post here;
http://spacefellowship.com/Forum/viewtopic.php?t=3403
I don’t want to re-type all that.
My $ 0.02 worth.
I think this conversation has run its course. Thanks to everyone for participating.
Jeff